Alex 163 BBb LOCAL SALE ONLY

[prodigal]

Does it run sharp?

[Mary Ann]

It was Wade who noticed how far I had the tuning slide out (as far as it will go) when I made the video. I don't even remember putting it on a tuner, but I must have, or, it just sounded sharp to me, but for some reason it didn't ring my bell that I should mention that. But the valve slides don't need to be yanked excessively, so it's a bit of a conundrum. I was playing it today and I do have the 4th slide quite far out to get it where I it comfortable for me. I put the update in the update thread.
If I end up giving it to Lee to put on consignment, I'll just let him worry about tuning slide stuff. There is someone who can make one locally, but I suspect I'd not be satisfied with the cosmetics.

[TxTx]

I have a Willson Eb that ran pretty sharp, but I could get it in tune with the main tuning slide almost all the way out - basically on the verge of falling off. I wrote Willson but they wanted a fair amount for a longer one. Fortunately @Unclebeer is just up the road and he simply replaced the smaller diameter tubes on the original tuning slide with longer ones that he was able to draw to just the right diameter, rather than making a whole new slide. So it basically looks like a slide that is pretty far out - same as with the original slide - but it isn’t going to fall out, and you just can’t push it all the way in. And I have the original tubes which could be put back on if necessary.

Eric

[bort2.0]

Do you have a photo of the slide in the "out" position?

[catgrowlB]

Not all tubas are tuned the same.
I actually use a sousa bit in one of my tubas, and a mouthpiece adapter in another tuba of mine. My other tubas don't need it. But here is the mouthpiece adapter I use in one of my tubas:

https://www.dillonmusic.com/products/jk ... 7843341510

Having a whole new longer main tuning slide made will probably cost hundreds of dollars. Using a sousa bit, or a mouthpiece adapter (which is pretty much a straight bit) can not only give a better playing angle with weird mouthpipes, but can lower the pitch roughly 10 - 20 cents, depending how far it goes into the receiver and how far the mouthpiece goes into the bit/adapter.

[the elephant]

What I observed was the main slide out about halfway and the horn still being at least 20¢ sharp. This makes me think it was built at A=445-ish, which I cannot use at work by contract. (A=440 is our official tuning pitch level, as per our CBA.)

[pmgtuba]

An update thread is mentioned - where can I find that? (Is that where I can find the video?)

[the elephant]

It can be played very well in tune (like most 163s, once you learn their quirks), but I like my MTS to be nearly all the way in, as—for me—this nets a better scale on any tuba. Again, though: that is for me. I do not like current 186s because they are now built to a higher pitch standard and you have to order a long "440 slide" on request.

I guess it is a shallow sort of aesthetic thing.

If Gebr. Alexander could cut a 163 BBb play in tune at A=494, I would just buy one of those, heh, heh, heh…

This in no way is a problem with this instrument, which sounds like an excellent example to me. I am merely being wishy-washy about moving back to BBb tubas, and this is just enough of a sticking point for me to decide to wait. For someone else, this will be a great instrument with a monstrous sound.

For the unwashed masses, a pitch standard of A=494 would pretty much make a Bb instrument sound like a modern C. (A=493.88?) It is the same idea of pitch creep over time, like the lower of the two tuning references usually used by Bach (415), which is about a half step, I think, making one of Bach's As sound more or less like a modern Ab. I don't really remember. I left school 33 years ago.

[Lee Stofer]

Tuning is a very individual thing. It was once noted that, when the CSO was on tour in Japan, and Mr. Jacobs met with the tubist of the Tokyo
Symphony, he invited him to try out the York CC. He had to pull the main slide almost all the way out to be in tune, whereas Mr. Jacobs had to have
the slide nearly all the way in.

Peter Hirsbrunner told me that when he built his 6/4 York copy, he made three main tuning slides of differing lengths for them, and would have players
try them all and find what best fit them, or would make another if necessary.

I have a couple of customers that require modifications to every tuba they purchase. One player requires a longer main tuning slide, and after playing
it with the original, he'll tell me how much longer he wants his slide to be, and it is pretty consistent from instrument to instrument. When modified, it really fits the player. Another customer needed a shorter main slide. I tried playing the tuba, and it played in-tune all the way up and down for me, but I wasn't going to tell a seasoned pro that he needed to change how he played. I slightly shortened the tuba, and he was delighted with the results.

It is also important to look at the overall instrument. With the last example above, the instrument had a relatively short main tuning slide to start with, and difficult to access. It had a long leadpipe, easily accessible, so I pulled the leadpipe, removed 1/2" at the large end, carefully re-tapered the large end and re-installed the leadpipe, and the player could comfortably play it. By keeping the full pull potential of the main tuning slide, it could still be played by others without excessive pull.

The mouthpiece, and the individual playing the tuba, make a significant difference as to where the main tuning slide needs to be pulled to play in tune. If the Alexander BBb in question eventually comes here, Eric & I will play, evaluate, and ensure that it is a winnner when it is advertised for sale.

[Mary Ann]

I got a quote for $229 (pre-tariff) for a new slide, which I don't fund unreasonable, but they want me to say how long it needs to be, but after reading all the above, it seems that my getting a slide so it is on pitch for me might be a waste of money for whoever ends up with it, on top of my not really knowing how much longer it should be even for me. I don't remember what the temperature was in here when I did the video; I'm keeping the thermostat at 81 this summer. And I typically use the 443 slide in the NStar, not excessively pulled out at all, so why get one that might "fit the definition" but not actually do the job. The current slide, in the video, shows about four inches of slide that could be pushed in, and it could not be pulled father. Wade apparently listened to the pitch on the video, and what came through on his end, with the recording and the playback, who knows if that meant anything anyway.

I probably need to sell this locally to someone who can play test it. The sound, now that I'm starting to get some competence on a BBb, is really fantastic.

I didn't post the video because at the time I was not at all competent on BBb. I'm somewhat better now, and I might make another video, but I'm not posting the first one. It is DAMN HOT HERE (113 my car said yesterday) and I don't feel like doing much. I'm not willing to have the AC run without stopping all day long, so it isn't 76 in here. As you know, the hotter it is, the farther out the slide has to be.

[bort2.0]

I'd love to buy it, but I'm not quite there yet. I know this is an excellent tuba. The 163 has always been "the sound," and the BBb has always been consistently better than the CC 163. Not that the CC is always bad (newer ones are very good!), but as I understand it, the old CC's were basically cut down BBb's. That is... This was designed as a BBb, so it doesn't have the same quirks as the made-to-work CC version of old.

PS, my great grandmother was born in Mainz, Germany, so I always thought it would be cool to have an Alexander. (Ok, ok, to have one _again_ )

[Mary Ann]

I've given up. I'm not going to try to ship this anywhere any more. Sorry about that. I'm tired, I would need help just to get it back in the box, into the truck / van, and I no longer have the energy to go around trying to find a way to ship it.

If somebody wants it, they can come get it like the buyer of the Alex F did. That person can do what they want in terms of a tuning slide. I'll be happy to get on Zoom and show it to such a someone.

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