Long 3rd slide

[Robson]

Hi guys!

Is it normal a long 3rd slide on an Eastman tuba?

I saw on Bloke's review of a Eastman (copy of a King 2341) that the 3rd slide was too long

I have an Eastman 864 F tuba (great tuba, by the way), but the 3rd slide is too long.... 5th position (2+3) is always flat

Can I lip the note? Of course I can, but I'm allergic to note lipping hahahahaha I prefer slide pulling

[Sousaswag]

That’s not unusual for many makes. On their rotor F tubas? I haven’t experienced that.

You say 5th position… Are you a recovering trombone player? Practice with tuning drones in your ear with long tones. See if the pitch comes up.

[bloke]

I have an Eastman 864 F tuba (great tuba, by the way), but the 3rd slide is too long.... 5th position (2+3) is always flat

I'll take your word for this...

Typically (with many conical brass instruments) the 2-3 combination (just as with 5th position on a trombone) is severely sharp for some pitches and severely flat for others. I'm pretty sure this is because there's a tremendous amount of cylindrical tubing involved (distorting the taper) YET it's used for FOUR pitches - rather than only two, such as with 6th and seventh position (or 4th valve and 2&4 valves).

Typically (valve combination 2-3 with F tuba) 2nd partial C# (just below the staff - F tuba) tends sharp, 3rd partial (G# at the bottom of the staff - F tuba) tends slightly sharp, and C# (middle of the staff - F tuba) tends flat. whereas the top C# (just above the staff (also tends flat.

BUT THESE CAN ALL VARY ON VARIOUS MODELS OF F, E-flat, C, and B-flat TUBAS (as their body tapers all vary from each other so drastically)...

but (in general, being less specific about particular partials' tuning characteristics) 2-3 is "squirrely" (again, just as is 5th position on the trombone).

Eastman rotor tubas are (sort of, though some config and taper differences) copies of early B&S F tubas.
With my (6-valve) B&S F tuba, I LOWER the pitch of the C# below the staff by playing it with 1-2-6, whereby I can tune the #3 slide to FAVOR the two flat-tendency pitches played with 2-3. G# (as far a so-called "slot") is so barn-door wide, that I can put it anywhere (as long as I'm paying attention - and I believe I generally do).

[RoseCityInstruments]

This might be helpful information:

This may be some useful information:

BBb Tuba 18 ft. open pipe
CC Tuba 16 ft. open pipe
F Tuba 12 ft. open pipe
Eb Tuba 13.5 ft. open pipe
Bb Euph/Tenor Trombone - 9 ft. open pipe
Bb trumpet/cornet - 4.5 ft. open pipe

Tuba tuning circuit lengths:
Valve tubing lengths:
F
1st valve = 18"
2nd valve = 8"
3rd valve = 27"
4th valve = 48"

Eb
1st valve = 20"
2nd valve = 9 1/2"
3rd valve = 29 1/2"
4th valve = 52"

CC
1st valve = 23.7"
2nd valve = 11.257"
3rd valve = 34.957"
4th valve = 61.62"

BBb
1st valve = 26.66"
2nd valve = 12.66"
3rd valve = 39.32"
4th valve = 69.32"

Credit to Dan Schultz for these, I saved them for when I finally decide to custom make a tuba...

[bloke]

good...but - based on experience - I wouldn't (if doing a build) just start measuring and cutting - fully relying on that chart.

[Robson]

That’s not unusual for many makes. On their rotor F tubas? I haven’t experienced that.

You say 5th position… Are you a recovering trombone player? Practice with tuning drones in your ear with long tones. See if the pitch comes up.

In fact I'm a trumpet player having fun with the tuba...

[Robson]

I have an Eastman 864 F tuba (great tuba, by the way), but the 3rd slide is too long.... 5th position (2+3) is always flat

I'll take your word for this...

Typically (with many conical brass instruments) the 2-3 combination (just as with 5th position on a trombone) is severely sharp for some pitches and severely flat for others. I'm pretty sure this is because there's a tremendous amount of cylindrical tubing involved (distorting the taper) YET it's used for FOUR pitches - rather than only two, such as with 6th and seventh position (or 4th valve and 2&4 valves).

Typically (valve combination 2-3 with F tuba) 2nd partial C# (just below the staff - F tuba) tends sharp, 3rd partial (G# at the bottom of the staff - F tuba) tends slightly sharp, and C# (middle of the staff - F tuba) tends flat. whereas the top C# (just above the staff (also tends flat.

BUT THESE CAN ALL VARY ON VARIOUS MODELS OF F, E-flat, C, and B-flat TUBAS (as their body tapers all vary from each other so drastically)...

but (in general, being less specific about particular partials' tuning characteristics) 2-3 is "squirrely" (again, just as is 5th position on the trombone).

Eastman rotor tubas are (sort of, though some config and taper differences) copies of early B&S F tubas.
With my (6-valve) B&S F tuba, I LOWER the pitch of the C# below the staff by playing it with 1-2-6, whereby I can tune the #3 slide to FAVOR the two flat-tendency pitches played with 2-3. G# (as far a so-called "slot") is so barn-door wide, that I can put it anywhere (as long as I'm paying attention - and I believe I generally do).

I'm thinking about triming the slide. Is it a good ideia?
I really prefer to pull the slide if necessary....Lipping flat notes can be very annoying ....

[bloke]

top C# (above the staff) usually works quite well (security and pitch) with 2-4 if 2-3 is flat for that particular pitch.

I know others who've shortened that circuit.

If yours is a rotary B&S copy, I'd recommend (if shortening is decided upon) shortening the circuit tubes which lead up to the slide, and not shortening the slide tubes themselves. (remove the #3 slide assembly, shorten the tubes, reinstall the assembly...It's actually LESS work).

[RoseCityInstruments]

good...but - based on experience - I wouldn't (if doing a build) just start measuring and cutting - fully relying on that chart.

Same here, but it's better than no information. Way too many variables in play to really know what the right answer is.

[Robson]

top C# (above the staff) usually works quite well (security and pitch) with 2-4 if 2-3 is flat for that particular pitch.

I know others who've shortened that circuit.

If yours is a rotary B&S copy, I'd recommend (if shortening is decided upon) shortening the circuit tubes which lead up to the slide, and not shortening the slide tubes themselves. (remove the #3 slide assembly, shorten the tubes, reinstall the assembly...It's actually LESS work).

Top C# is little flat.... a little, but I'm picky
I tried 2-4, but it's very sharp on my Eastman
I'll think a little more before deciding if I'm gonna trim or not

Thank you guys!!!

[Snake Charmer]

On my Eastman EBE 853 (front-action compensated Eb) I had to cut off 1/2" from the third valve bow to make it playable. On the other hand it wasn't long enough to pull it out making it two whole steps like I'm used to from some of my other horns

[Robson]

Hey guys!

I decided to cut and I'm feeling much better now
I've cut 1/8" on each leg of the 3rd slide

Thank you very much!

[gocsick]

F Tuba 12 ft. open pipe

F
1st valve = 18"
2nd valve = 8"
3rd valve = 27"
4th valve = 48"

What this tells me is that F is the best possible key for a tuba in Americab freedom units.

I did some calculation... if we want the best possible European tuba in metric units. the key that works out to nice round lengths is B natural

B natural tuba 523cm open bugle
1 64cm
2 31cm
3 99cm
4 175cm

Proving once again that America is better than Europe.

[Mary Ann]

I cut the third slide on one of mine because I could not get the Ab up to pitch -- and did not cut it enough. I sold that tuba to someone who likes it, for what I had in it, so it's all good.